fresh political humor (barack obama)

[griff61]

Support the President? Most military folks refused to salute Slick Willy and I see this happening again in the near future.  Duckbutta you rock.

Great idea, because the people's representative should always be subservient to the military...just like it says in the Constitution.

I served in all through the 90's, there may have been people who said they wouldn't salute, but I doubt they followed through (like they even had an opportunity). We didn't care for him much after Somalia, but he was still the CINC.

Took an oath to uphold the Constitution, not my Party.

[flew-da-coup]

Support what?

Giving "tax cuts" to people who don't pay taxes?
A massive $787 Billion dollar spending spree disguised as an economic stimulus package?
Appointing a tax cheat to run the I. R. S. ?
Appointing an Attorney General that supported Clinton's pardon of convicted FALN terrorists?
Rewarding irresponsible homeowners by subsidizing their mortgages?
A European-style health care system?
Punishing achievers by raising their taxes?
Appeasing our enemies?
War on Capitalism?

Tell me, what one of those do you support?

OK, I'll bite.
Tax cuts to those on the lower 95% of income more directly stimulate the economy because the money is more likely to be spent.

The stimulus package is what it is, something had to be done, maybe it works, maybe not.  But we've already seen what happens when corporations are left to do what they please.  Now it's time to try to keep the economy from grinding to a halt.

As for his appointments, he should have used better judgement in a few of them, but he got who he's got.

Maybe you should look at how the loan reorganization plan actually works.  People who were irresposnsible before won't be getting any help, nor will speculators.  It's for people's primary residence, and they have to re-qualify.

I'll take Universal healthcare over anything we have right now.  I'd prefer the Canadian system, however, what is being proposed isn't even in the arena of European style anything.

I'll start crying about those poor folks who make more than $250k as soon as they start caring about those who are left destitute.

Appeasement. . . I don't think this means what you think it does.  Which 'enemies' would you be talking about?

Capitalism needs to be tempered with social responsibility.  That's how societies function, you can't have straight capitalism any more than you can have real marxism.

In any case, agreeing or disagreeing on any of these things still are not an excuse to refuse to support the President or to wish him failure.  If he fails, the country fails.

Did I about cover it?

It is funny how so many people in this country love the thought of universal healthcare when they have never had to deal with it. I have a friend in the UK who had been told that he had 90% blockage in 2 arteries and need heart stints. He was told that it would be 2 months before he could be scheduled in for the procedure. However, he did only have to wait 1 month and one week. He got bumped to the head of the line because he had a heartattack! He was almost killed due to national healthcare, but you never hear these stories unless you know someone it happened too. Canada isn't any better. Many Canadians come over our borders for healthcare due to the fact that the Dr.'s offices are always packed and backed up. Personally I would rather pay for my healthcare, but that is what makes me different then the liberal minded people out there. It's called personal responsiblity. Some have it and some don't. Which leads me to your comment about those who make more than $250K. Why should those who work hard have to pay for those who are lazy or refuse to better themselves? I have a neighbor with only a 9th grade education and is a convicted felon and he worked hard and now makes very good money. So don't give me this under privleged distitute BS. It's the individual who makes his on destiny in this great country. Your comments are socialist leaning communist.

As for those that are getting a mortgage bailout, well, you are wrong. Those that lied on their mortgage application on income ARE eligiable for the bailout. You might want to read up on the whole issue.

[Duckbutta]

Griff,

With a thought process like your's, you'll never have to worry about making $250k, so your meager earnings will be safe under Obamessiah. $30k/year Bench Techs won't be paying any of the freight.

Thanks for the support, Bailey. It's much appreciated.

[Winterfire2008]

My my, what happened to not calling people names and insulting them?

If a person wants universal health care. . . . that doesn't necessarily make them "socialist leaning communists".

If a person feels that only those who have money should receive health care, that's fine too.  Don't know too many people who can outright pay for transplant surgery though, or the on going care a diabetic needs.   

There are those who say that is what insurance is for.   Those in the pool pay to spread the cost.  But what if you can't get in the pool because of a pre existing condition?

Even here in the United States, if you happen to have health insurance, you wait for a procedure based on what care the insurance company says they will pay for.   I don't see too many employers offering the old system where they totally cover the cost of insuring their workers and you get to choose whatever doc you want, what hospital you want to use, and not make co pays.  Well except for United States Congressmen.   

Personal responsibility is fine.   However, what happens when a person loses their job through no fault of their own? Isn't it nice to know there is unemployment insurance, food stamps to feed the hungry, know a person can go to a public hospital emergency room and they won't be turn away?  Not much of safety net.   I continue to pay my taxes to support my country.   I also give to charity.   Now maybe I am being a liberal bleeding heart, but giving a hand to those who need it isn't a bad thing.   Still better than anywhere else in the world.

[Duckbutta]

Reaching into one's own pocket to help one's fellow man is praiseworthy and should be commended. Reaching into another's pocket to provide help to one's fellow man is reprehensible and worthy of condemnation. You might call that charity, I call that theft. God didn't say, "Thou shall not steal, unless one can get a majority vote in Congress." I'm tired of politicians putting my money where their mouth is.

[griff61]

It is funny how so many people in this country love the thought of universal healthcare when they have never had to deal with it. I have a friend in the UK who had been told that he had 90% blockage in 2 arteries and need heart stints. He was told that it would be 2 months before he could be scheduled in for the procedure. However, he did only have to wait 1 month and one week. He got bumped to the head of the line because he had a heartattack! He was almost killed due to national healthcare, but you never hear these stories unless you know someone it happened too. Canada isn't any better. Many Canadians come over our borders for healthcare due to the fact that the Dr.'s offices are always packed and backed up. Personally I would rather pay for my healthcare, but that is what makes me different then the liberal minded people out there. It's called personal responsiblity. Some have it and some don't. Which leads me to your comment about those who make more than $250K. Why should those who work hard have to pay for those who are lazy or refuse to better themselves? I have a neighbor with only a 9th grade education and is a convicted felon and he worked hard and now makes very good money. So don't give me this under privleged distitute BS. It's the individual who makes his on destiny in this great country. Your comments are socialist leaning communist.

As for those that are getting a mortgage bailout, well, you are wrong. Those that lied on their mortgage application on income ARE eligiable for the bailout. You might want to read up on the whole issue.

flew-da-coup:

I lived in Canada, under that system, for 20 years. It is heAd and shoulders above what we have here. So rather than go by anecdotes, I actually base my opinion on personal experience with 4 different systems, Canadian, US Military, the VA and US Civilian.

No one in my extended family in Canada was ever put at risk for want of coverage or services. Thos who come to the US are normally getting elective surgery and those who aren't are covered by the Canadian system and are sent stateside for treatment if necessary.

Canadians pay 50% less per capita for universal coverage, while we pay the highest per capita amount on the planet and have >40 million uninsured.

I would like to point you to some resources about the subject. I used them when I did a research paper when I was in college.

What it costs us relative to other nations http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/46/2/38980580.pdf

What a single payer system does http://www.pnhp.org/facts/singlepayer_faq.php#raise_taxes

A UK type system is a recipe for disaster, I agree. There are far more creative ways to solve the problem. Most will save employers and employees a ton of money. Among the biggest expenses is Insurance company overhead and profit taking. In the Canadian system, the insurance middle men are eliminated. You can still buy private insurance over & above, but everyone is guaranteed basic coverage.

As for your problem with my statement about people making over $250k, should I guess that you are one of them or one of us obviously lazy types who make less? I don't see any logical correlation between your anecdote and my statement. I said I don't feel sorry for them any more than they feel sorry for anyone else.

I've read up on the mortgage program, being eligible and being approved are two different things. Those who apply for the program have to re-qualify, that will be a hard road for people who lied on their previous loans.

[griff61]

Griff,

With a thought process like your's, you'll never have to worry about making $250k, so your meager earnings will be safe under Obamessiah. $30k/year Bench Techs won't be paying any of the freight.

Thanks for the support, Bailey. It's much appreciated.

You're a funny guy. Can you actually compose a response without an insult?

Was that really the only thing you could find fault with in my response?
Is that the best response you can come up with?

I invite you to try again, using what we like to refer to as "facts" and a little tact.

[flew-da-coup]

It is funny how so many people in this country love the thought of universal healthcare when they have never had to deal with it. I have a friend in the UK who had been told that he had 90% blockage in 2 arteries and need heart stints. He was told that it would be 2 months before he could be scheduled in for the procedure. However, he did only have to wait 1 month and one week. He got bumped to the head of the line because he had a heartattack! He was almost killed due to national healthcare, but you never hear these stories unless you know someone it happened too. Canada isn't any better. Many Canadians come over our borders for healthcare due to the fact that the Dr.'s offices are always packed and backed up. Personally I would rather pay for my healthcare, but that is what makes me different then the liberal minded people out there. It's called personal responsiblity. Some have it and some don't. Which leads me to your comment about those who make more than $250K. Why should those who work hard have to pay for those who are lazy or refuse to better themselves? I have a neighbor with only a 9th grade education and is a convicted felon and he worked hard and now makes very good money. So don't give me this under privleged distitute BS. It's the individual who makes his on destiny in this great country. Your comments are socialist leaning communist.

As for those that are getting a mortgage bailout, well, you are wrong. Those that lied on their mortgage application on income ARE eligiable for the bailout. You might want to read up on the whole issue.

flew-da-coup:

I lived in Canada, under that system, for 20 years. It is heAd and shoulders above what we have here. So rather than go by anecdotes, I actually base my opinion on personal experience with 4 different systems, Canadian, US Military, the VA and US Civilian.

No one in my extended family in Canada was ever put at risk for want of coverage or services. Thos who come to the US are normally getting elective surgery and those who aren't are covered by the Canadian system and are sent stateside for treatment if necessary.

Canadians pay 50% less per capita for universal coverage, while we pay the highest per capita amount on the planet and have >40 million uninsured.

I would like to point you to some resources about the subject. I used them when I did a research paper when I was in college.

What it costs us relative to other nations http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/46/2/38980580.pdf

What a single payer system does http://www.pnhp.org/facts/singlepayer_faq.php#raise_taxes

A UK type system is a recipe for disaster, I agree. There are far more creative ways to solve the problem. Most will save employers and employees a ton of money. Among the biggest expenses is Insurance company overhead and profit taking. In the Canadian system, the insurance middle men are eliminated. You can still buy private insurance over & above, but everyone is guaranteed basic coverage.

As for your problem with my statement about people making over $250k, should I guess that you are one of them or one of us obviously lazy types who make less? I don't see any logical correlation between your anecdote and my statement. I said I don't feel sorry for them any more than they feel sorry for anyone else.

I've read up on the mortgage program, being eligible and being approved are two different things. Those who apply for the program have to re-qualify, that will be a hard road for people who lied on their previous loans.

I guess Canada's healthcare is okay if you don't have any serious issues arise. The US is the world leader in new medicine. You know why, because it is market driven. Take that away and you will have medical advances like Canada ( Nothing ). That may sound good to you, but not me. Also, I was not saying that people making less than $250K are lazy. I am saying that people that are "destitute" are lazy. I make almost $80K here in Georgia and I live fine, but I am also not jealous of those who make more than me and I don't think it is fair for those making more money to have a bigger tax % burden. Punishing people for being productive is counter productive. That type of mentality is right out of Marx's manifesto. Class warfare is the basis of Fascist Socialism and Communism. That is a slippery slope that has destroyed several nations. 

[griff61]

I guess Canada's healthcare is okay if you don't have any serious issues arise. The US is the world leader in new medicine. You know why, because it is market driven. Take that away and you will have medical advances like Canada ( Nothing ). That may sound good to you, but not me. Also, I was not saying that people making less than $250K are lazy. I am saying that people that are "destitute" are lazy. I make almost $80K here in Georgia and I live fine, but I am also not jealous of those who make more than me and I don't think it is fair for those making more money to have a bigger tax % burden. Punishing people for being productive is counter productive. That type of mentality is right out of Marx's manifesto. Class warfare is the basis of Fascist Socialism and Communism. That is a slippery slope that has destroyed several nations. 

Maybe I should have been more explanatory. My extended Canadian family includes people of pretty much every age and medical requirement. Hell, I'm practically related to half of Quebec. I've had family treated for everything from stitches to skull fractures to hystectomies and diabetes with no delay of treatment and no financial burden. The Canadian standard of care is every bit as good as the American, I would direct you to look at http://www.aboutkidshealth.ca/News/Top-10-Canadian-medical-advances-for-children-in-the-last-100-years.aspx?articleID=10414&categoryID=news-type as far as advancing medical breakthroughs goes. There have been plenty great Canuck doctors (and British, French etc). The US doesn't have a corner on brilliance.
Canadians, on the whole, get better care for less money and they do it by fairly consistantly running budget surplusses. Some things should not be left to market forces, like basic healthcare. Partly because it isn't a free market at all.

No one chooses to be destitute. That is a myth. Some choose to be homeless, jobless, etc, but destitution is a hole that has no bottom.

I'm not jealous of anyone, but I do believe that those who reap the greatest benefit should contribute the greatest share. It has nothing at all to do with Marx. Marx had this odd idea that a doctor would be ok making the same as a ditch digger even though it took more schooling and skiils. I didn't even suggest that.

[Duckbutta]

Griff, I didn't think you merited a response, but I will oblige you anyway.

How can 95% of the people get an income tax cut when 95% of people don't pay income taxes. Almost 50% of the workforce currently don't pay any income taxes. Therefore, it's disingenuous to call Obama's welfare payments tax cuts. It's just taking a dollar from someone that earned  it and giving it to someone that didn't earn it.

Coup is right about the mortgage plan. Democrats stripped out the language in the bill that would have made people that lied on their mortgage applications ineligible. And your wrong about requalification, it's not in the plan.

The top 10% of taxpayers pay about 70% of all taxes. As far as I'm concerned, they are already paying more than their fair share.

And no, I will not compromise my principles and support the president. One thing you don't seem to understand is that if he succeeds, the country will fail.

[griff61]

Griff, I didn't think you merited a response, but I will oblige you anyway.

How can 95% of the people get an income tax cut when 95% of people don't pay income taxes. Almost 50% of the workforce currently don't pay any income taxes. Therefore, it's disingenuous to call Obama's welfare payments tax cuts. It's just taking a dollar from someone that earned  it and giving it to someone that didn't earn it.

Coup is right about the mortgage plan. Democrats stripped out the language in the bill that would have made people that lied on their mortgage applications ineligible. And your wrong about requalification, it's not in the plan.

The top 10% of taxpayers pay about 70% of all taxes. As far as I'm concerned, they are already paying more than their fair share.

And no, I will not compromise my principles and support the president. One thing you don't seem to understand is that if he succeeds, the country will fail.

I know, you tend to have this thing about making pronouncements and not responding to other folk's postings in response.

You  keep moving the goalposts. Perhaps you could actually take up my actual responses to your original questions? I'd even settle for how you think the current economic situation should be dealt with, in a realistic way that would be better and would work in the real world.

I'm looking forward to the locations of those facts.

As for the mortgage plan http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=100831129
or http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/03/04/obama-mortgage-plan-unvei_n_171854.html
or http://www.wisebread.com/details-of-obamas-mortgage-plan-released-will-you-benefit

It's actually more of an executive order, so there's not really any bill for Democrats to be stripping anything out of. It didn't require Congress' approval.

[Winterfire2008]

Hmmmm is it charity or is it theft?. . . . . . there are some that think that the government giving food stamps to help a young mother and her child because she lost her job is theft,  but if you personally hand her the money to buy food  that's commendable.   I don't think she really sees the difference.   All the young mother cares about is that her child is fed.

If a person doesn't agree with how the US government spends money, just don't pay taxes and move to another country.   Then one can honestly say that he/she doesn't support any of the United States government policies. 

Of course be prepared for the consequences.

[Duckbutta]

They should at least have the courtesy to send me a Father's Day card.

[flew-da-coup]

Hmmmm is it charity or is it theft?. . . . . . there are some that think that the government giving food stamps to help a young mother and her child because she lost her job is theft,  but if you personally hand her the money to buy food  that's commendable.   I don't think she really sees the difference.   All the young mother cares about is that her child is fed.

If a person doesn't agree with how the US government spends money, just don't pay taxes and move to another country.   Then one can honestly say that he/she doesn't support any of the United States government policies. 
Of course be prepared for the consequences.

  I have no problem with helping those who find themselves in an emergency money flow problem. It happens. However, if I were to find out tomorrow that I have no job I do not qualify for any assistance, even for my diabitic child. It is called "earning potential". I pay for the welfare, medicade and food stamps through my taxes, but I have no access to it if I need it. That is a fact that NO ONE can deny. FDR who came up with the Raw Deal ( New Deal ) was a socialist who even comptemplated making his presidency a dictatorship. Yes that is right. For you who want to argue this point don't bother. It is fact written in his own hand. It kills me to see our country getting closer and closer to a socialist nation. Yes there is welfare out there, but unless you are a liar and willing to lie on the application for welfare none of you are qualified to get it if you need it. So in short the welfare system needs to be revamped completely. People can blast me for my political beliefs, but mine are the same as our forefathers. If George Washington saw the taxes that are being forced on our population he would want to start a new revolution. The Federal Governement has superceded it's power and function. Anyway, I am rambling now. Sorry.

[griff61]

Hmmmm is it charity or is it theft?. . . . . . there are some that think that the government giving food stamps to help a young mother and her child because she lost her job is theft,  but if you personally hand her the money to buy food  that's commendable.   I don't think she really sees the difference.   All the young mother cares about is that her child is fed.

If a person doesn't agree with how the US government spends money, just don't pay taxes and move to another country.   Then one can honestly say that he/she doesn't support any of the United States government policies. 
Of course be prepared for the consequences.

  I have no problem with helping those who find themselves in an emergency money flow problem. It happens. However, if I were to find out tomorrow that I have no job I do not qualify for any assistance, even for my diabitic child. It is called "earning potential". I pay for the welfare, medicade and food stamps through my taxes, but I have no access to it if I need it. That is a fact that NO ONE can deny. FDR who came up with the Raw Deal ( New Deal ) was a socialist who even comptemplated making his presidency a dictatorship. Yes that is right. For you who want to argue this point don't bother. It is fact written in his own hand. It kills me to see our country getting closer and closer to a socialist nation. Yes there is welfare out there, but unless you are a liar and willing to lie on the application for welfare none of you are qualified to get it if you need it. So in short the welfare system needs to be revamped completely. People can blast me for my political beliefs, but mine are the same as our forefathers. If George Washington saw the taxes that are being forced on our population he would want to start a new revolution. The Federal Governement has superceded it's power and function. Anyway, I am rambling now. Sorry.

Could you point me to where I can see that FDR wrote that he wanted to change the Presidency to a dictatorship?
As far as food stamps, etc, the qualification requirements for those are genereally set by your State and not the Feds, which is why the rules change from area to area.
What would you like to see revamped about the welfare system?