I thought this was a joke at first, but this is dead serious! The question is: Is Agilent gonna pull Davis up or is Davis gonna drag Agilent's reputation down? I'm betting on the latter. I cut and pasted this right from Agilent's website:
SANTA CLARA, Calif., June 23, 2009
Agilent Technologies Inc. (NYSE: A) today announced it has entered into a long-term partnership with Davis Calibration, a leading third-party calibration services provider offering a comprehensive set of calibration and repair services for test, measurement and control equipment. Together the companies will provide high-quality calibration services for a wide range of test and measurement equipment, addressing greater than 90 percent of customer needs onsite. The companies will provide these services -- covering greater than 80,000 individual model numbers -- from more than 35 locations in the U.S. and Canada.
In today's economic environment, companies are looking to reduce the complexity and cost associated with the calibration and maintenance of test equipment. An effective way to do this is to use a single-source provider for calibration services. By focusing on a single supplier with the capability to perform the work on site, the costs associated with test equipment downtime, shipping and handling, order processing, calibration data retrieval, asset service history, and issue resolution are significantly reduced. However, choosing a single-source calibration supplier who can cover the breadth and complexity of test instruments from various manufacturers has been a challenge - until now.
"We have provided onsite calibration service for Agilent's breadth of high-performance test equipment," said Steve Aleshire, vice president and general manager of Agilent's Americas Service Operation, "but customers wanted us to expand our capability to address calibration of other manufacturers and types of test equipment --- without diminishing the convenience, quality and consistency they've come to expect. By drawing on Agilent's depth of knowledge and measurement expertise, combined with the reputation and breadth of capability offered by Davis Calibration, we can now address our customers' complete service needs, maintaining the convenience of a single point of contact throughout the process while reducing the total cost of their test equipment maintenance program."
"If customers could choose an OEM to calibrate their instruments it would be Agilent Technologies," said Mark Rohde, CEO of Davis Calibration. "But today the total cost of a maintenance program is driving customers to choose a supplier based not only on quality, but breadth of capability and onsite convenience. Choosing the Agilent and Davis partnership for calibration provides the highest confidence in meeting these three decision criteria. Now, with seamless delivery and one contract, our customers can get the combined coverage, cost benefits, and expected quality of the world's largest test and measurement service provider."
Services from both companies are ISO 17025 accredited and include the full range of calibration offerings required by commercial and government entities. Calibration capabilities cover electrical from DC to optical, flow, pressure, mass, temperature and other physical / dimensional products.
Agilent and Davis Calibration service account representatives will work together to provide a customized service solution to match specific customer needs. To learn more, visit the "Agilent/Davis Partnership Reception" at the upcoming National Conference of Standards Laboratories International (NCSLI), Sunday, July 26, 5-7 p.m.
To be fair, Agilent's reputation hasn't got very far down to go. Perhaps Davis will improve it.
Griff,
I would agree that Agilent has slipped some in recent years. However, the fact of the matter is that they are still the premier test equipment manufacturer in the world. Bar none. Nobody is even close. They are definitely the Top Dog in the RF realm and that's where they should keep their focus.
The press release states that it's a long-term partnership. I just hope for Agilent's sake that they have an opt-out clause. My gut reaction to this deal is that it is a bad idea. Probably the same type of feeling one would get when pulling the trigger on a Wavetek purchase.
I'd take a Rohde & Schwartz over an Agilent E series any day, better support. Agilent left that behind along with the HP name and company ethics.
Agilent could use anything that improves their customer service image, Davis might be a good thing. Might even improve them both.
Quote from: griff61 on 06-28-2009 -- 23:55:30
I'd take a Rohde & Schwartz over an Agilent E series any day, better support. Agilent left that behind along with the HP name and company ethics.
Agilent could use anything that improves their customer service image, Davis might be a good thing. Might even improve them both.
It's hard to take you serious when you make statements like that.
Rohde & Schwarz is an ongoing joke in our lab. The Air Force bought a bunch of that garbage and the stuff that our lab received just sits on the shelf. Nobody uses it. The only time it ever gets turned on is when it's due cal. The performance is subpar and their menus are a navigation nightmare. Agilent is much more intuitive and technician friendly and is as reliable as the day is long. Our R&S stuff is so bad that we would much rather use older Agilent and 80s vintage HP Sig Gens and Spec Ans instead.
Agilent provides excellent support for their products. At least the type of support that I need. Most of their manuals are available for free online as are firmware upgrades and software. Whether the equipment is current or obsolete, it doesn't matter. Help is just a double-click away. No other manufacturer provides that level of support.
You obviously don't have much RF experience. Stick with what you know.
I have to agree with Duck Agilent is one of best manufacturers out there. I don't know about actually phone tech support, but that is a joke no matter who you call. At least Agilent lets you download their manuals off the internet without having to register. I think in the long run this hurts Agilent.
Quote from: Duckbutta on 06-29-2009 -- 02:05:14
You obviously don't have much RF experience. Stick with what you know.
Didn't take you too long to revert to form, luckily I'm beyond your level on pretty much everything, please feel free to impress your friends.
I'll still take the R&S, Agilent finally got back around to not charging for every last thing after their market share dropped. There was a very rough period after the split. Agilent made a point of doing things the Microsoft way, no support once the new model comes out. You basically had to have a paid support agreement to get any answers. The 83650 is an example of that. If they've returned to the Bill & Dave way, that would be a nice, welcome change.
To each his own.
Rhode & Schwarz is an acquired taste, my exposure to it is somewhat limited but have found it to be quite satisfactory.
Griff,
Again you show a complete lack of understanding of business. What you describe is typical of all test and measurement equipment manufacturers. Typically, new products have a 5 year life cycle in which the manufacturer will support their models. After that they are deemed obsolete and they will not continue to manufacture replacement sub-assemblies because it is not economically prudent to do so. They will continue to sell whatever parts they have on-hand until the stock is depleted. Agilent is by no means unique in this regard.
So...... all I want to know is, if I am sending an item to an "Agilent Service Center", how can I tell if it is a Davis site or not.....
Know what I mean?
And I do not have much experience with R&S equipment, definitely not enough to make a call on Agilent vs R&S. But, I will say that any and everything I have ever needed from Agilent whether it be equipment issues, TME issues, manuals, or whatever- I ALWAYS have an answer within 24 hours.
Heck, I needed a part for an E4448A and I got in next day....... no extra charge. (Granted, the part was obscenely priced, but hey, you go OEM you pay OEM prices- I'm still trying to figure out how the 13 yr old supervisor of the 8 yr old assembly worker managed to get it here in 24 hours :-o )
Quote from: CalibratorJ on 06-29-2009 -- 16:29:18
But, I will say that any and everything I have ever needed from Agilent whether it be equipment issues, TME issues, manuals, or whatever- I ALWAYS have an answer within 24 hours.
.
Sounds like they returned to the Bill & Dave support ethics again. Good to hear
Yea, those little Malaysian kids are hustlers.
Calibrator J,
If I remember correctly you have both an N5531 and an FSMR in your lab there.. You are in a unique position because not may labs have both standads..
I would like to here your thoughts on using them both side by side.
Mike
Actually, the FSMR belongs to the APSL. I now work with Region 2 at the newly opened TSC Redstone.
And as far as I know, the FSMR has not been used even once. Matter of fact, the APSL is holding onto it and not getting it cal'd as I'm not sure if I can do it (as I do all of the 8902s and MMRs) and R&S wants nothing short of a fortune to do it, plus they really have no use for it at all.
So, sorry dude, no experience with it here..... however, if I ever do manage to get my hands on it (doubtfully) I will give it a go and let you know what I think.
Quote from: CalibratorJ on 06-30-2009 -- 16:59:56
Actually, the FSMR belongs to the APSL. I now work with Region 2 at the newly opened TSC Redstone.
How many stateside Army TMDE labs are going/have gone civilian? I remember RSA rather fondly
Quote from: griff61 on 06-30-2009 -- 17:46:00
Quote from: CalibratorJ on 06-30-2009 -- 16:59:56
Actually, the FSMR belongs to the APSL. I now work with Region 2 at the newly opened TSC Redstone.
How many stateside Army TMDE labs are going/have gone civilian? I remember RSA rather fondly
I was shocked to see Ft Drum go at least paritally civilian, there's a job WG-2602 posting over on ecalibration.com.
How about those in the know of the large scheme of things start threads for their respective branchs on the current state of affairs, leaving out rumors of what might come just what has happened?
Quote from: Greenice on 06-30-2009 -- 17:55:39
Quote from: griff61 on 06-30-2009 -- 17:46:00
Quote from: CalibratorJ on 06-30-2009 -- 16:59:56
Actually, the FSMR belongs to the APSL. I now work with Region 2 at the newly opened TSC Redstone.
How many stateside Army TMDE labs are going/have gone civilian? I remember RSA rather fondly
I was shocked to see Ft Drum go at least paritally civilian, there's a job WG-2602 posting over on ecalibration.com.
How about those in the know of the large scheme of things start threads for their respective branchs on the current state of affairs, leaving out rumors of what might come just what has happened?
I saw that, I worked that lab as a green suiter a long time ago...tempted to apply for the nostalgia factor
Testing an FSMR is not too awful difficult but rather tedious, figure a couple days for your first time manually.
First there is the spectrum Analyzer Portion, pretty conventional.
Next is the measuring receiver, they use an arbitrary waveform generator (R&S model AMIQ) with some test waveforms (free downloads) for modulation Accuracy & distortion.
The grand finale is the Tuned RF Level function. You would be best to do it IAW the service manual even if you have some great decade attenuator, just use it in place of the fixed devices they specify but do the tare thing as described in the manual, less grief that way.
This does not include the NRP-Z37 sensor.
Seems like last time I inquired it was over $4 grand for them to do it.
Well, I reckon I could wander off and write a thread on the state of calibration, or the lack thereof, in the Army. But it would just depress me.
I finished up 2 years at the 94H schoolhouse right about a year ago, and it is a sad sad state. Our new techs are not "trained" in calibration. Heck, they aren't even trained how to use our standards. It is all theory and practical exercises using equipment so bugged out and broken you couldn't even begin to repair it back to within specs, that is IF you could get the parts. Luckily, we will be getting that task here shortly before they pack up and move to the "Center of Excellence", which happens to have a big ZILCH of a community in the neighborhood with the calibration "skill set". Everyone in the neighborhood they are moving to has a GREAT background in wheeled vehicle mechanics though......
Thank you CASCOM for completely screwing the schoolhouses from writing their OWN lessons using NEW equipment and NOT the stuff from TWO generations ago.
And, with the deactivation of 95th Maintenance Company, the dozen and a half or so of military teams left now belong to FORSCOM (think mowing grass, shooting guns, changing vehicle oil, playing GI Joe for weeks at a time while wearing camo and triple stranding a 1 mile perimeter- I mean come on, WHO TRIPLE STRANDS ANYMORE! Call the dang engineers FFS!) No one in the Army has a GARRISON mission, why should a cal team? You don't use multimeters or radios or vehicles unless we are at WAR!
Ok, enough of me rambling.
I guess I should see what I can dig up on the FSMR cal procedure. Might be "fun" to give it a go, if I have the stuffs to do it. Plus it would give me a reason to play with it for a few weeks......
Quote from: CalibratorJ on 07-01-2009 -- 20:07:02
before they pack up and move to the "Center of Excellence", which happens to have a big ZILCH of a community in the neighborhood with the calibration "skill set".
Humor an old, obsolete 35H and tell me, where might that be?
To the wonderful Fort Lee Virginia, aka Mechanicsville, US Army......
Hit me up at my username on here at gmail
Quote from: griff61 on 07-02-2009 -- 12:42:54
Humor an old, obsolete 35H and tell me, where might that be?
We never go obsolete, we just use obsolete equipment :-D
Humor an old, obsolete 35H and tell me, where might that be?
[/quote]
When did you go thru 35H school. I went thru in 75/76 and then to Korea and Cp Carroll for 2 yrs.
PapaBear
Quote from: dminesinger on 07-03-2009 -- 02:52:35
Humor an old, obsolete 35H and tell me, where might that be?
Quote
When did you go thru 35H school. I went thru in 75/76 and then to Korea and Cp Carroll for 2 yrs.
PapaBear
88/89, then Panama (2 years), Drum (3 years) and mass reclass into 27X (PATRIOT), oh the joy of ADA....which meant Ft Bliss/Middle East/Ft Bliss/Middle East/Ft Bliss/Middle East/Ft Bliss/Middle East on and on....then they accidentally sent me to a non-existant depot in Germany so I became Bn Ops Sgt till I got out in 00
Davis will not enter this cal lab and cal our standards!They are above Tech Master and that is not saying much.
Agilent has proven that they do not learn from previous mistakes.This will just piss off customers and they will cancel on-site from Agilent.
Quote from: RFCAL on 07-09-2009 -- 12:09:19
Davis will not enter this cal lab and cal our standards!They are above Tech Master and that is not saying much.
Agilent has proven that they do not learn from previous mistakes.This will just piss off customers and they will cancel on-site from Agilent.
Seems they've bought some pretty decent labs, not sure I'd be too quick to judge, but maybe you have the inside scoop?
Money can buy a lot of things: very pretty labs, awesome workbenches, state of the art equipment to fill every workbench, shelf and rack in said lab, accreditations :roll:, and even decent technicians with framed accreditations and certificates. But when it is all said and done, it comes down to business philosophy.
I will take my old Sheffield Modules any day (despite feeling like I am in a submarine) over some of the alternatives. I know what we can and can't do and that every DA Label 80 and test report that goes out my door (without a pretty logo on it mind you) is accurate and traceable.
Not saying anything about anyone, but anyone can buy a nice lab and fill it with nice things and the results can still be less than desirable.
Quote from: CalibratorJ on 07-10-2009 -- 19:29:04
Money can buy a lot of things: very pretty labs, awesome workbenches, state of the art equipment to fill every workbench, shelf and rack in said lab, accreditations :roll:, and even decent technicians with framed accreditations and certificates. But when it is all said and done, it comes down to business philosophy.
I will take my old Sheffield Modules any day (despite feeling like I am in a submarine) over some of the alternatives. I know what we can and can't do and that every DA Label 80 and test report that goes out my door (without a pretty logo on it mind you) is accurate and traceable.
Not saying anything about anyone, but anyone can buy a nice lab and fill it with nice things and the results can still be less than desirable.
No doubt, I've seen many nice certificates that might as well be framed in dookie, I'm just wondering if/why there is such a bias against Davis. To be honest I hadn't heard very much about them until quite recently.
Quote from: Duckbutta link=topic=1336. msg13434#msg13434 date=1246259114
It's hard to take you serious when you make statements like that.
Rohde & Schwarz is an ongoing joke in our lab. The Air Force bought a bunch of that garbage and the stuff that our lab received just sits on the shelf. Nobody uses it. The only time it ever gets turned on is when it's due cal. The performance is subpar and their menus are a navigation nightmare. Agilent is much more intuitive and technician friendly and is as reliable as the day is long. Our R&S stuff is so bad that we would much rather use older Agilent and 80s vintage HP Sig Gens and Spec Ans instead.
Agilent provides excellent support for their products. At least the type of support that I need. Most of their manuals are available for free online as are firmware upgrades and software. Whether the equipment is current or obsolete, it doesn't matter. Help is just a double-click away. No other manufacturer provides that level of support.
I don't know what vintage of R&S equipment you have in your lab, but my hands-on experience with the R&S FSU and FSMR shows me that it blows away the Agilent PSA/N5531S, both as a spectrum analyzer and as a measuring receiver. The performance of the former is much better than the Agilent.
I agree that in the past, the UI (user interface) of the R&S left something to be desired, but they have listened to customers and are closer to the Agilent than ever before, making it intuitive as well as a fairly easy transition for Agilent users, not to mention virtual software compatibility.
R&S has also worked hard to upgrade their support system in the US as well, just one of the reasons why they divorced themselves from the alliance they with Tektronix.
I hate to say it, but Agilent
is just a shadow of its former self, in my opinion.